Excuse the Intermission
Alex and Max take you on a journey through film with this discussion podcast about movies.
Excuse the Intermission
The Master of Jackets: A Ryan Gosling Odyssey
Dive headfirst with us into the dynamic filmography of Ryan Gosling, as Seattle's own Marcus Baker, a filmmaker with a knack for comedy and an eye for cinematic detail, joins us to dissect "The Fall Guy," Gosling's latest high-adrenaline flick. Marcus, with his roots in the Seattle Film Society and his short film "Three Women and a Possible Fire Next Door," provides a unique filmmaker’s perspective on Gosling's evolution from a meme-generating heartthrob to a serious actor with a penchant for action-comedy. Together, we unravel the entwined threads of humor, stunt work appreciation, and the nuanced performances that set Gosling’s projects apart, all while Marcus offers anecdotes from his own experiences in the industry.
How's it? I'm Alex McCauley.
Speaker 2:And I'm Max Fosberg.
Speaker 1:And this is Excuse the Intermission a discussion show surrounding movies. On today's episode, max and I will be joined by a special guest to help us discuss the new film the Fall Guy and the movie's leading man, ryan Gosling. Gosling's star power has perhaps never been as strong as it currently sits, so in celebration, we will look back at his career to date and give you our top five Ryan Gosling powered vehicles. That conversation up next, after this quick break.
Speaker 2:This episode is brought to you by the Seattle Film Society. The Seattle Film Society is a filmmaker run project dedicated to organizing, cultivating and celebrating the region's filmmaking community Through screenings, educational opportunities and community initiatives. Seattle Film Society strives to be a centralizing force for Seattle-area filmmakers.
Speaker 1:Their monthly screening event, Locals Only, is held at 18th and Union in Seattle's Central District and spotlights local voices in independent filmmaking. Tickets start at $10 and are available at seattlefilmsocietycom.
Speaker 2:To keep up with the Seattle Film Society, be sure to check them out on Instagram or Letterboxd at seattlefilmsociety or on their website seattlefilmsocietycom, Come be a part of the next generation of Seattle filmmaking today.
Speaker 1:Ok, we're back and delighted to be joined in studio by Marcus Baker. Marcus is a Seattle based award winning writer and director whose short films have been featured at various festivals across the United States, center around real life experiences that focus on class, injustice, trust and community. He is also the acting president and artistic director for the Seattle Film Society, a collective of filmmakers and film enthusiasts who dedicate themselves to uplifting, showcasing and facilitating the next generation of Seattle area filmmakers through educational opportunities and screening events. As if those accolades weren't enough, he is also a returning guest here on ETI. We had the pleasure of getting to know Marcus during last year's festival circuit and couldn't be more excited to have him back on for a full episode. Marcus, how are you doing today, bud?
Speaker 3:I'm great that was a lot more than I expected. I didn't realize I had such a long bio, you know.
Speaker 2:Alex is he's many things, but he is an excellent introductory. Writer.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I'm honored. Yeah, no, it's good to be back. I've been a regular listener to the pod. Especially recently I've been moving and so like that whole process, like I've been listening to a ton of ETI on top of the ETI I was already listening to, so I'm excited to be here.
Speaker 1:Do you ever think about that, Max?
Speaker 2:Like what we might be a soundtrack to.
Speaker 1:That's maybe a slippery slope, moving's very wholesome, I like that I am very happy to be the soundtrack during someone's move yeah, that's.
Speaker 2:That's probably my favorite way to help someone move. A lot of, uh, moving and cooking. Cooking is the big one for me as well, that's when I, that's my main.
Speaker 1:That's very intimate I crush a bunch of podcasts during cooking as well that's a really good one max.
Speaker 2:How are you? Doing today, uh great yeah, happy to be here. I'm glad marcus is in studio. We got him down south here in tacoma and uh, yeah, just excited to talk some goss.
Speaker 3:Oh, man, boy, I'm, I'm ready to talk about the goose it's great to talk about.
Speaker 1:The goose is loose on this episode. But yeah, marcus, we got to know you a little bit last year. We first saw your film 100, at the Bremerton Film Festival. You're a Bremerton native, so that was really cool.
Speaker 3:But it wasn't really until the Tacoma Film Festival that we linked up, had you on the podcast during that episode, and then you and max have been collaborating up at the seattle film society, so just kind of, what's your last, I don't know six months, 12 months, been like um in the arena of film. Yeah, yeah, I um a lot of film society stuff. We are having our uh. We have a monthly screening event called locals only um, and that has been happening at uh. First it was happening at the arc lodge, our, our most recent event has been at the CIFF Film Center in downtown Seattle and starting next month it'll be at 18th and Union, which is in Seattle Central District. But so we've been doing that, been working on some new programming for SFS as well, and then on top of that I have a short that has been making its way through post-production Uh. It's called Three Women and a Possible Fire Next Door. Max also worked on that with me.
Speaker 2:I did, I did. It was a delight Uh, really, really excited to see the finished product.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, it's coming together and it's uh. Right now I think we're in coloring and sound design and I'm uh, I'm excited to hopefully get it on, get it into festivals or start submitting to festivals, I think, uh not, if not fall, definitely hopefully later this summer.
Speaker 1:I'd say Very cool Anything that you've learned new on this last production or how it kind of compares to your other projects.
Speaker 3:Yeah, uh, the first two things I made were a bit more serious. I, with this one, I really uh set out to make an out and out comedy. Um, I'm a big fan of screwball comedies. You know, bringing a baby and uh, it happened one night, all that kind of stuff, um, and so I uh really set out to do that and I learned that that is very hard. Uh, I was fortunate to work with a great team. I had really great actresses to work with, um as well. Um, and, yeah, it's, it's been a, it's been an exciting process for sure.
Speaker 1:That's interesting to always hear about and think about when it comes to comedy, because what's funny on the page? Once you get everything set up, your actors in place and you start rolling, it might just be different.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh, totally. First thing I ever made was comedy and it was a lot funnier when we did. The table read yeah, yeah and I think especially with like something like a screwball comedy.
Speaker 3:I mean, it's so dialogue heavy and it's very cadence based, and that was something that we strove or we worked really hard on. But again, it's just, you know you can only do so much, and then you're, you know you're making the film three times you're writing it, you're directing it, you're editing it and it's a process. So it's been. It's really been enlightening. I've really enjoyed it. So that's awesome.
Speaker 1:Why I echo Max's sentiments very much. Looking forward to seeing that and, yeah, maybe to hear once it's out. You don't have to say anything now, but maybe once it's out you can tell us what Max is like on set. Oh, man.
Speaker 3:No, tell the people Off mic, off mic.
Speaker 1:Okay, so the number one movie at the domestic box office this past weekend was the Fall Guy, the latest film from director David Leitch. $28.5 million here in the United States, plus another $36.9 million in international markets, for a grand total of $65.4 million worldwide. That is against a $130 million budget, so that's not great. However, we can later discuss whether or not that's an issue with the film's competency or a more macro problem with how audiences choose to interact with films such as this. But let's back it up a little bit. The Fall Guy is a movie star driven project with two capital A A listers at its core. So when it comes to Emily Blunt and Ryan Gosling's performance and their subsequent chemistry, could you two separately don't answer at the same time but what did you make of their chemistry?
Speaker 1:Could you invest in these characters for two hours while watching this movie?
Speaker 3:uh, yeah, I mean, I, I struggled a bit, um, I, I think I I like gosling and I love blunt, obviously, um, I think for me a lot of the issues really go back to the script. Um, I think that's a lot of the reason why the romance, uh, doesn't totally work, because it doesn't really connect the way they set it up. They don't. It doesn't really connect to the um, the larger narrative. I would say, um, at least not an effective way. I feel like it, like it, it, this, all of this stuff with Emily Blunt's character and like the missing um Aaron Taylor Johnson character, all that stuff, that stuff like it. It comes in maybe like an hour in, maybe 45 minutes in, and it it has really almost no bearing, except up until the very end. I felt like um and it's, it's, yeah. So I, I felt, I felt like it doesn't totally work, um, for a myriad of reasons.
Speaker 2:But I'm kind of curious to hear what you guys have to say I I really bought gosling and blunt and I honestly the stuff I didn't like in the film, and not that it's a bad film, it's a fine film. It's a five out of ten. It's it's it's a good time at the movies. I wish my rth. I went and saw it with mar.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I wish our theater was a little bit more packed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I thought it was pretty sparse Because I think it is kind of a film that really feeds off, tries to feed off the audience energy and if that energy is not there then things are going to feel a little flat. And again, I loved Blunt and Gosling. I wanted the whole movie just to be about that relationship, about making movies, and just put the whole movie on set right, show me all that movie-making stuff. I thought the Aaron Taylor-Johnson crime thriller kind of thing that they were trying to do. It reminded me a lot of Bullet Train, which makes a lot of sense because Bullet Train is also directed by David Leitch. Do you know? It reminded me a lot of bullet train, which makes a lot of sense because bullet train is also directed by david leach. Um, he's also done what dead bull, deadpool 2, atomic blonde. So you know, we can argue if those movies are successful or not, but I just I I think they had, I think it was a little wasted potential, because the chemistry is sizzling between the two stars.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for me. I thought that that first hour basically up until what Marcus is referencing, when the crime narrative enters the picture was so heavily focused on just the dynamic and the relationship between Gosling and Blunt that it worked for me where that was enough to keep me afloat as an audience member, until the the, the secondary plot, kind of picked up speed, and then when that happened I was like, OK, I'm in because you didn't lose me with this romance. I still, I've, I've bought in and I guess also too, we should just kind of detail in a quick little spoiler free fashion what the movie is about. Gosling is a stuntman who has a relationship with Emily Blunt as she is a camera operator, and then he suffers and then film director.
Speaker 2:From operator to director, quick jump In nine months.
Speaker 1:Which I think that's kind of funny honestly honestly, I think that they know what they're doing by, by placing her in a role that heavy um so soon in her career. But but I do. I do think that once, once he he suffers an accident and then once he returns, and there's this like you have to return to your former glory kind of moment, kind of narrative for gosling, you're never not going to be rooting for him as he's going through that, and then you're Like you have to return to your former glory kind of moment, kind of narrative for Gosling. You're never not going to be rooting for him as he's going through that, and then you're never not going to be rooting for them to be together. And so that part all worked enough for me to where it felt.
Speaker 1:It felt to me like we weren't manufacturing anything. I was trying to think of all these other like male, female, two handers, where it is a similar type of plot, where I just don't buy it, I'm not invested, or I just think that, like, these guys are fine, the chemistry is kind of there, but I don't really think that they would actually be into each other in real life. And what I found so exciting about their two performances in this movie is that I'm like for all we know about Emily Blunt and John Krasinski and their relationship and for what we do and don't know about. Ryan Gosling and Eva Mendes, like these are two pretty high profile movie stars that we know a lot about their personal life, and this goes back even to their little bit at the Oscars this past year. You see them together and you're like I would buy you as a couple. I get it, and so the movie has that at the bare minimum going forward, so I responded pretty well to it.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think for me a lot of what I struggled with there was just feeling like I felt like the Emily Blunt character didn't have anywhere to go and I also. So much of the second half of the movie really relies on the movie that she is making. This movie star is missing and like she doesn't know, like she's not aware of that, like that's such an important piece to me and to me I think that makes her seem ineffectual and in a lot of ways incompetent and I just I had a lot of trouble with that and the fact that like the crime plot feels so separate for the rest of the movie, even when they do intersect at the end. To me it just I just don't think it really worked for me.
Speaker 1:Speaking of intersections, I feel like there's a really fine line that this movie is towing between wanting you to buy into the realism of what this situation could actually be like, versus like a full parody of a Hollywood production, where I think that Emily Blunt is she's being painted as someone who is being gaslit by this, like megamind producer and I'm not sure who that person is supposed to be emulating from real life, but I I feel like there's there's some sort of tongue-in-cheek winking action happening here where the, the screenplay and the director and the people who made this film wanted to be like.
Speaker 1:This is the kind of shit that either does or doesn't happen. But we know that you guys probably suspect that, whether it's Tom Cruise actually behaves like this or some of these other big action stars behave like this on set, or that they can just disappear, and that there's so many people, there's AD's and there's assistance to assistance and so much can get lost in the shuffle. And we're kind of also making a meta commentary on ai and we don't even need superstars to be on set anymore because we can digitally screen your face and ryan gosling, you're just gonna play the part. And then that reaches a crescendo with the jason mo ma, ma oa joke at the end, which I thought was hilarious so.
Speaker 3:So that's a real interesting thing too with this movie, where I think that Jason, oh, I don't know, I need a sticky note, I need a sticky note.
Speaker 1:So so that's a real interesting thing too with this movie, where I think that I think that, depending on how you go into it and what you expect to get out of it, goes a long way. Because if you're able and I'm not saying that like that's a knock against anybody who can't just like, take it at face value, because we all want our movies to have some sense of realism, to um and understand that like okay, well, and and that speaks to the vfx and we'll get to the action here in a minute but like when something just doesn't feel right or look right, you do have to hold that against a movie. So I totally understand where you're coming from, but I also think that there's another side to that coin.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, not not to step on your toes, marcus, but you said something really interesting after we walked out of the theater, uh, where you felt that maybe, like they came up with the stunts and then they built from the stunt out right like for for the story and the plot and especially the script. I mean the script and and listen, I wasn't going in thinking this was going to be fucking lawrence olivier on, you know right, delivering some amazing script, but it does.
Speaker 2:it did feel again, I think, I think, whenever you leave the movie set because I, I want, I want the, the crazy producer and and like stephanie shoes character who only has six minutes in the movie as uh, you know, tom writer's agent, you know it just have all those characters on set and then we're, we're just bouncing around on set. I, I think it could have worked. I also saw an interesting comment saying you know, for a movie that's about highlighting stunt men, they really missed an opportunity to make one of ryan gosling's stuntmen, the the like alice actor.
Speaker 1:Oh, instead of been a really meta, yeah, it could have been a really meta funny thing.
Speaker 2:But then again, then we don't get aaron taylor, johnson's matthew mcconaughey, which was probably the one of the highlights of the film iconic wellconic.
Speaker 1:Well, and I also think too I wonder how much of just kind of trying to wrap my head around it, because I do agree that this feels like they had a couple action set pieces. David Leitch wanted to make a movie about stunt work, and highlight stunt work and if you pay attention to the publicity and the campaign trail for this movie, it has been all focused on bringing the stunt people onto the red carpet.
Speaker 1:Ryan Gosling is there with his stunt man on the red carpet at the film's premiere at South by Southwest, and so I think maybe they could have been a little bit more cognizant of putting that into the film and not just using that for the marketing purposes behind it all. But a part of me still wants to give this movie a lot of credit for and Gosling and Blunt, specifically because I feel like and I put this in my Letterboxd review that I feel like the type of roles that they are playing in this film would be like the type of roles that if somebody like Jimmy Stewart or Cary Grant were still alive today and making movies, this would be the kind of like leading man, leading woman roles that they would get put into. They. I don't think that they would be doing superhero movies. I don't think that they would be doing genre pictures like a horror film or hard sci fi or anything like that.
Speaker 1:It would be these, these action I mean this is what they did. Action I mean this is what they did. Like I said, this is. This movie is basically the ADHD version of North by Northwest, where there is a crime and there's a case of mistaken identity and or conspiracy and a man has to sort of go on the run with the aid of his female confidant and in love interest, to help prove his innocence. As we kind of meet all these different people who come in to the picture, have a cup of coffee, coffee, a couple of action set pieces, and it's low stakes. We know that.
Speaker 1:we know that carrie grant's gonna be okay at the end of north by northwest like we know, ryan gosling's gonna be okay by the end of this, and when I think of like the charisma that that gosling brings, it's the charisma that somebody like carrie grant brought back then, and so I saw a lot of people are saying that it's like a love letter to action movies of the nineties and a few other things like that. I think it goes even further back to to like action comedy romances that we don't get anymore, and I think that's why the box office people didn't respond to it, because the marketing looks fun and it's cool to watch a couple interviews on your instagram reel or whatever with emily blunt and ryan gosling, but no one actually wants to sit down, even though all we do is talk about the need for original programming well, and I know, it's adapted from a book
Speaker 2:or whatever, but like a tv show. Tv show, yeah, but like it's ip, universal has been pushing it as ip like it's coming back yeah, yeah, like it's gonna be a franchise, and there's also.
Speaker 3:There's also a um. I just saw an ad today for like a peacock show. That's like. It's like action, that's all about like stuntmen, that's like a docudrama and there's, like it's by uh david leach's company, 87 north uh, which, uh, if have eyes, you certainly saw his logo plenty in that movie.
Speaker 3:But like it's. It's like there's a lot of footage from like behind the scenes of the fall guy and it's all about stuntmen and that kind of thing. So it seems like they're really trying to like, if there's not an immediate response to the film, certainly like, certainly see that in a way, would say which is fine if it goes that way.
Speaker 1:It goes that way, and then we can tear that stuff down.
Speaker 3:But in the moment I'm like this.
Speaker 1:This is what I want to see at the top of the box office for a week yeah, it's, it's fun, I had a good time with it.
Speaker 3:I I I have my critiques, but, like I, at the end of the day I would much rather see something like this that's very star driven, that's at least making an attempt to be very character driven. And, as you know, something I haven't seen before on screen all those stunts. I'd never seen those before. That's great. That's a fun time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so like if, yeah, we want to pivot to the action, I mean the the stunts are fantastic and and to watch that on screen, on a big screen, in a movie that's really highlighting those is is just a joy. And and yes, you know Gosling is is a charisma machine and I could watch him do anything, but really the stunts are kind of the star.
Speaker 1:Well, I feel like, yes, I feel like the romance, the star power of blunt and Gosling are right there and then, but like on equal footing, is the action and the stunt work. Maybe it's like a tick down, but still it's like right there.
Speaker 3:And I love.
Speaker 1:I love too that the action in the film because it's about stunt work, it's very self-referential, like they're. Even Gosling makes a joke in the movie about how there is no stunt Oscar at the Academy Awards. And and they're referencing big budget action franchises Like Tom Cruise does get his name dropped in this movie. Winston Duke is hilarious in this movie and always referencing other action movies that he's worked on, like he punches a guy and says Jason Bourne or whatever.
Speaker 3:That's the Mohicans yeah yeah. And they rushed for the Tomahicans yeah yeah. And they rushed for the Tomahawk yeah yeah.
Speaker 1:So, so part of me loves that, because it's we I, you know we're always going to respond well to movies about movie making and or that take place kind of in our universe. That creates some other head scratching moments too, though, where it's just like okay, so does Ryan Gosling exist in this universe?
Speaker 3:Does Emily Blunt exist in this universe? Does Emily Blunt exist in this universe?
Speaker 1:but that's going too far down the rabbit hole and then you're just like actively trying to not enjoy a film when you start thinking about that kind of stuff even though it's a, you know, I don't know, take it or leave it, I don't know I'll defer to you as the filmmakers.
Speaker 2:Is that a plot hole? I don't know. Metal Storm is Dune. I mean that. Oh yeah, they have the sound. Down to the music, down to the music. So funny, I like how max?
Speaker 1:yeah, we're sitting right next to each other. I was like howling at that part.
Speaker 3:Yeah, um yeah, I, I would agree with you. I mean, I think like, um, oh, shoot, I lost my train of thought. It was right there.
Speaker 3:But yeah it is, it is metal storm or it is dune and I like that. It um. I like that the film tries to bring those elements into it where it isn't um, where it is referencing things that do exist in our world and that kind of thing. I think that stuff is really fun. It did make me kind of curious because the theater Max and I saw it in, we saw it in the AMC in downtown Seattle and I would say it's about like a half full theater and I think some of those jokes really fell flat. There's a lot of those jokes that are very like if you're not like in the know then like they might just go right over your head.
Speaker 3:So I was really curious, or I'd be curious to know how it plays in like a New York or LA where there is like a more concentrated, larger entertainment industry. Because I think, like I turned to Max the first time we see Emily Blunt on set, the camera's just like going around her as as people are coming to her with questions and I was like, oh, I understand this.
Speaker 3:This is exactly what it's like and I imagine so many people in those markets would definitely understand that, but I don't know how much that plays in a place with a smaller yeah. And like you know, you're Every town USA and you know Nebraska or something.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:Well, I also too. I hope that there is an understanding for most audience members that every single part of the hard work that that stunt men and stunt people go through down to, even like stunt dogs, gets recognized in this movie too, and so I do feel like, even though we're having so much fun with it, there's a lot of like.
Speaker 1:I feel like this is an oddly sentimental movie when it comes to certain situations that they put the actors and the characters in, even down to like. I I'm sure that. I mean, I'm sure that everybody, from every different level of a film production, maybe, maybe not, I guess, but keep some sort of like keepsake from a film and so like. Something that I loved in this movie is Gosling's wearing, like the stunt team, miami Vice jacket which is so steezy shirt, oh my god like oh my god and so just every little thing like that.
Speaker 1:I'm like this is an attention to detail moment here that, like I, I'm going to take a second to acknowledge and appreciate, because it's something that if it wasn't in the movie I don't think I noticed it, but the fact that it's in the movie, then you do notice it and I think that that helps create a little bit of a greater sense of appreciation.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, no, yeah, yeah, no, definitely I think I uh and without getting uh even to like the dog speaking in a different language.
Speaker 1:I just think that's hilarious.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah yeah, the the dog biting uh a dude's balls by uh with a german command feels very 90s in that way.
Speaker 3:Um, I was gonna say, without getting too high on my high horse about it, I think it is interesting to kind of think about this film within the context of the uh, you know, last year's labor strikes and that kind of thing as well, where, like, it is a film that is very much making a concerted effort to recognize the labor that goes into entertaining people, I mean the people that are like sacrificing their bodies just to you know, just so I can laugh in a theater or just so I can be like holy shit, that stunt was absolutely incredible. Like I think this film is very much concerned with that and there's been a larger push I'm sure you guys have talked about it within the past couple of years to really like to get that stunt Oscar category, because there are so many stuntmen that have gone unrecognized for generations, especially since action movies have ramped up since the 80s, and so I think this movie kind of feels like it's trying to bring all of that to a head.
Speaker 1:And I know they just added a casting category, so it's certainly fresh in people's minds that you can just add a category if you want to, well, and you're going to get more that that train's going to, you know, pick up more and more steam when you do have people like chad stahelski and david leach and these, these folks who have come up through the ranks and are now making their own films, because that's what's going to put it on front street yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, you guys are teaming me up like uh t-ball because I have here a list of the Gosselin's stunt doubles in this film. Given that the Fall Guy is a no to stunt work, I thought it was only right to bring up Gosselin's stunt doubles. His personal stunt doubles were Ben Jenkins, justin Eaton, his driving double was Logan Holiday and his double on the stunt at the beginning where he breaks his back is Troy Brown.
Speaker 1:And another really cool thing that the film does is it gives those people and stunt doubles for most of our other main principal performers in this film their moment with the end credit sequence, kind of split screen moment where they're showing the behind the scenes filming of so many of these stunts, which I thought was just another really cool thing where they didn't have to do that.
Speaker 1:But, it just speaks to that effort that you're talking about, marcus, where there was a lot of intentionality as far as recognizing everybody from top to bottom, so I thought that again, just a great choice, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, and I also I think something else that does kind of even play within the whole recognizing the labor is that it's also a movie about the process of doing a stunt, and I think that's just as important, as you know, pointing out who did this stunt or what have you where, like you are seeing like the effort that goes into, like strapping someone into a roll cage, like the film takes the time to show you those things, because, like those, those safety precautions, those kinds of things are just as important. Uh, there is much a part of the process of um of uh, of entertaining people as they are actually doing the stunt and being safe about it. I mean, there's, I think that's again that's. It is kind of what's so interesting about like the stunt gone wrong at the beginning of the film, where, like that's the only time that, like you don't really see the process, and then, like you see the process at the end and it's like oh, yeah, this is intentional.
Speaker 1:Yes, so so. Lastly, this film is also trying to be a comedy and I do think that I mean, there were certainly moments where I laughed, where people in my theater were laughing out loud. How do you feel that the jokes landed? I mean gosling, could, I feel like, make anyone laugh? Blunt has a lot of really good moments. There's a really funny like karaoke scene. There's some good music cues, some good, a good jukebox soundtrack with this film, so as as just kind of an overall entertainment vehicle, laughs included. Sounds like your theater was a little sparse, but how did you find the comedy?
Speaker 2:I mean, we, we laughed quite a bit, uh I. I think my favorite bit was the uh during the. I think it's like one of the first or maybe the second stunt that gosling's doing on this new film, uh that emily blunt is directing and she stops production to like explain the characters it's a great scene, yeah the characters, like you know, uh motivations and a total metaphor for their relationship exactly, and she keeps making him do the on fire stunt.
Speaker 2:I think that it was some really really great funny stuff. But yeah, I mean Gosling, gosling can just look at the camera and make you laugh, I mean that's the power of him you know, and I know we're going to get into his long career here soon, but he does have a gift for that kind of comedy where he doesn't even have to really say much.
Speaker 3:Yeah yeah, max and I again. We talked about this after our screening, but I think I struggled with the comedy element of it, and I think there's two reasons for that.
Speaker 3:One and this is my one little insider piece that I was like I'm going to bring this to the podcast.
Speaker 3:Like Ryan Gosling's favorite actor is Gene Wilder, and that was something that I thought about a lot while watching this movie, because I do feel like he's giving like an out and out comedic performance like he's really like, and I there's moments, especially like in that, the hallway scene where, like he's trying to get the the card to scan and it's not scanning.
Speaker 3:That feels like a Gene Wilder bit to me essentially. And David Leitch, to me, is directing an action movie, like that's very clear to me that that's what he's there to do, and I feel like there's a lot that got lost in translation there and I think that was a big part of why I really struggled with the comedy. There are funny bits, but I think to me the parts that I laughed the hardest were like laughs of recognition, like that thing on set where I was like oh, I've experienced that where you're getting asked a million questions, or like uh, or the dune bit, like laughs of recognition, like that I I don't know that I necessarily felt like um, so, uh, so invested in the character that I could like laugh with or at the character in that sense, uh. So yeah, it's pretty hit and miss for me.
Speaker 1:I'd say that makes sense, because I do feel like some of the out and out comedy and like the one-liners aren't always going to hit in a movie like this with a lot of stuff. Honestly, it's usually even when you think about like hard art rated comedies, something like Superbad. It's always the more subtle little things that on rewatch, you are like that's the funniest part in the movie right there.
Speaker 1:So I'm just thinking about like when, when there's a really cool split screen conversation that happens over the phone between Emily Blunt and Ryan Gosling. Emily Blunt, she's still on set, she's like in a trailer or something, and you can tell that she's just kind of like. I feel like this is a lived experience, where you're just sort of like around your props and you're tinkering with things or whatever.
Speaker 1:She, during this conversation, has one of the alien hands on with this giant claw so she's just kind of picking out her face with the claw the whole time with this giant finger, and it's a really funny bit, because that's not what you're really supposed to be paying attention to but, she's doing it to to the point where you can't ignore it, and so just little things like that.
Speaker 1:I was like that is what's really working in this movie, like ryan gosling sliding on the back of a metal plate trying to say one liners on the bridge, like that's, that's not it and that's never going to be it, no matter who your superstar is, what the movie's about. But but this movie, I think, does have enough of those little things that were like once this hits on demand, I'm definitely going to watch it again and watch for more moments like that that I think are pretty effective. But yeah, but I do agree that like as like, if I'm running a video store, this is not going in comedy, this is definitely going in action.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I I think where it's like bad boys 2 or something like one of the best I think like one of the best examples, like if you could take some of the best, most effective movies that have merged action and comedy together. There'd be a real discussion about like what section do you put this in Exactly?
Speaker 3:Exactly, yeah, and I think, even within that scene in particular too, like one of the things that I found myself thinking in like while watching it which is to me not a great sign when is just how much more they could have done with it. You know what if he'd found the body while he was on the phone with her? What, what if he'd done X, y and Z? That would have like ramped up the joke that like then he's like oh, I found a body and I'm on the phone with this woman, and like you know all this kind of stuff, I felt like there were just a lot of missed opportunities for either stronger jokes or better jokes and it just it that was. That was to me, that's the hardest thing when you're watching a movie is when you can see like just how, if you would have tweaked one or two little elements, it would have been just like it would have hit a little bit harder right, because you know it's not going to make me laugh like hallucinating a unicorn.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, you know, yeah yeah and and we know like being down on this, no, no, I really enjoyed it and Gosling can do that.
Speaker 2:I mean, he proves that in something like the nice guys, which is another great marriage of action and comedy, and Gosling is fucking hilarious in that movie the the bathroom bit where he's like.
Speaker 3:Shutting the bathroom door is an iconic bit. It's so fun.
Speaker 1:Okay, so any overall final thoughts on the film. It sounds like it's a weird one that like we can all recommend it, even though we maybe necessarily didn't like all of the movie.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I recommend seeing it in a theater. Hopefully it's a packed theater and however like, am I going to own this when it comes out? Probably not. Am I going to return to it? Maybe, you know, in a couple of years, when we do another Gosling episode?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree with that, and it's funny, though, because I think I'm like do I feel the same way about dead reckoning, part one?
Speaker 2:it was so it's really interesting because universal really thought this was going to be their mission impossible did they? That I was just listening to a pod on on the way over. Uh called the town which is all about hollywood, uh news and whatnot, and they're. They were talking about the fall guy and it's box office and whatnot and what universal's predictions and hopes and dreams were.
Speaker 1:Like a hundred million dollar movie. It sounds like a hundred million dollar movie.
Speaker 2:A franchise, a start of a franchise. They thought this was going to be De Palma's, like De Palma's Mission Impossible in the nineties. They had an A-list actor.
Speaker 1:Kind of puzzling.
Speaker 2:I mean somebody's going to get fired over there and you know that sucks. But uh, yeah, it is kind of crazy that uh, they because, because think, if this comes out in march and does these numbers, you're like, hey, that's, that's pretty successful, but this is in the like pre-summer marvel slot basically yeah, this is supposed to start the the summer summer season.
Speaker 3:Yeah and I, I think that I mean there's, I do think there's a chance it has some sort of legs. Um, I mean, I and I'm I'm a big proponent of like, just like opening weekend isn't everything, like you see, with challengers, challenges, like had, like it came in third this weekend, but it's made like like a million to two million, like over the last week, and it just clocked 50, like this past weekend.
Speaker 3:Yeah, um, and so I think there's a chance it does have like some legs to it, which I would be really excited about. Um, again, obviously we loved more original films, or at least like ip that hasn't been adapted a million times right um and no capes.
Speaker 3:No, we like that, yeah um spicy margaritas on the beach yeah, that's your biggest mcguffin in this movie is yeah that scene doesn't get cut, though, and I was really happy about that, because, like you, see that all the time where it seemed gets cut from a or it's like in the trailer, but it's not in the movie another really interesting point that was brought up on this other pod was that I believe it was like under 25 year olds I think it was like 16%, for under 25 males went to this 16% made up the box office.
Speaker 2:Under 25 females 13%. So like young people just aren't going. That yeah, and that's, and that's where I feel like this movie it's target audience.
Speaker 1:It doesn't, and I haven't watched a trailer for it and so I don't know. Like I I don't have my opinion on who I think they were targeting, but after watching the movie I'm like if you would have told me that this was a millennial's version of like a fast, kitschy, kind of hackneyed, but like still entertaining, like ode to a Hitchcock suspense film with some romance and some action. And then like some unsuccessful comedy, but some successful comedy, like I would have been so much more on board and even though I already went out and saw it, but like I would have been a lot more excited as opposed to just thinking like, is this free guy?
Speaker 3:Like what is this Well?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think. I think the title is you could have picked, just call it stunt man or something the fall guy. What does that mean to anybody?
Speaker 3:Well, I mean, yeah, I mean like it doesn't. I don't know it's weird, because I feel like it doesn't have that strong of an appeal to a younger audience. Like the marketing certainly tried to lean into the Ken of it all and that, like a lot of the shots you see of Gosling in the trailer, he's kind of dopey, he's. You know, he's charming in the way that Ken is kind of charming. But again, it didn't feel like it really found a way to capitalize on that and you know, I also feel like it's neither fish nor fowl in a lot of ways Again, with it being neither action nor comedy. And yeah, it's a weird one for sure.
Speaker 2:I'll tell you what Alexlex you calling this north by northwest was not on my bingo card listen, I'm speaking to the guy who doesn't even know if he likes hitchcock or not, and so hey I'm with.
Speaker 3:I'm with you, I'm with you there about there, I like some hitchcock, but yeah, it's a mess.
Speaker 1:I I just think I think that it's. I haven't seen anything, do what, and I'm not, you know hitchcock. I think people think that he's. I haven't seen anything, do what, and I'm not, you know Hitchcock. I think people think that he's like maybe, if you're a little bit just unfamiliar with the entire canon, that like he does horror movies and suspense movies but like this has a lot, I'm telling you.
Speaker 1:This has a lot of to catch a thief in it and the fall and the fall guy has a lot of north by northwest in it, and so it's there like if, and I'm looking for things to hold on to to, to make myself think that this won't just be like gran turismo or some other action movie from 2023 that we talked about and that we really liked, but that we're never gonna return to again and like, if I'm being completely honest, I might watch it once more on streaming, but like this movie is not going to be as important as like if it was doing really well, like that would be really good for movies.
Speaker 2:Cause.
Speaker 1:That's very true, and so it's just. I don't know it's too bad. I'm trying to be hopeful.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I I will say to that point of, uh, other right, I guess kind of other ways to think about the film. I do think that if we're looking at you know anything that we would change. I think the real pitch on this movie and this is my hot take that I'm really bringing in is that I think this works better if it's a Shane Black movie Like I think this is an out-and-out Shane Black movie that just doesn't have him at the helm and I think the film suffers for that. But it's got all the elements. I mean, I think you've got a film set it's not in LA, but you've got a film set in the entertainment industry and around it You've got a mystery at the core To me. It reminded me a lot of like Kiss, kiss, bang, bang, and I feel like it really needed, like a Shane Black to pull it all together.
Speaker 1:It would have been interesting to see what an R-rated version of this movie.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's true. If it's Shane Black, you're not getting $130 million.
Speaker 1:I thought it was R-rated. No, this is PG-13.
Speaker 3:PG-13, yeah.
Speaker 1:Okay. So as we transition and begin to reflect on Ryan Gosling's career, to this point there's a lot to analyze. He was born in 1980. Point there's a lot to analyze. He was born in 1980. His career began at a young age, with Mickey Mouse Club appearances and other various television shows in the 1990s, but it wasn't until the early 2000s that he broke onto the Hollywood scene.
Speaker 1:It doesn't take much digging to see that he's more than just a heartthrob or a leading man. He's a versatile actor with a real interest in pushing boundaries and exploring the complexities of the human experience. With each new role, I think that he continues to solidify his place as one of the most talented actors of his generation. He possesses a certain reluctance to conform to Hollywood norms, which is kind of what makes the Fall Guy in the last two or three years of his career so interesting. He is still selective about the projects that he takes on, often opting for roles that challenge him artistically rather than chasing mainstream success, although he has found plenty of that along the way. Nominated for three academy awards, he is one of the last true movie stars yet to hitch his trailer to a superhero franchise or a prestige television show. They don't really make too many actors like Gosling anymore, so what about him? Resonates the most with the two of you, oh man.
Speaker 3:Okay. So I came of age when Gosling was in his internet boyfriend days and I think to me that's something that Gosling and I think like to me, like that's something that Gosling as, as he's kind of moved into this other stage of his career, has really, in a way, never really escapes to me. I think like so much of the idea of like an Internet boyfriend, especially in, like you know, 2011, 2012, 2013 was really like really could be boiled like a man who is willing to be self-critical and I think that so many of his roles, especially his early roles, really reflected that. I mean Blue Valentine he's playing a very ugly person in that and I think a lot of his roles, um, since, have really played that drive is certainly it's an iconic role, but it's not like necessarily very pretty Um, and so I think a lot of um, a lot of my relationship to him initially was like grounded in that Um, and so that's one of the reasons that I also think that his transition to these kind of big budget blockbuster things has been so interesting, because I think it's really hard to transition the type of career he's had to, like being Harrison Ford and I don't know that.
Speaker 3:I'm curious to see how he'll navigate that, because you know, when I watch like Indiana Jones, and Indiana Jones is scared of snakes, I'm really empathizing with that and I'm identifying with that and that's where the humor comes from. But when I when I'm seeing like Ryan Gosling be, be kind of an idiot or or try to keep me to remove, I would say, as an audience member, um, I think that that can be harder to identify with, especially if you've got, you know, $130 million movie that you're trying to carry up a hill.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, he, he. It's really interesting cause he is like one for the millennials, right, like I mean, we grew up with them. He starts coming on hot on Mickey Mouse Club with Justin Timberlake, britney Spears, early 2000s he becomes a teenage heartthrob. Then, mid-2000s to mid-2010s, he is the internet boyfriend or the indie. That's really his indie run. Uh, where he's he is capital, a acting, but like he's never. He's never desperate when he's acting, he's, but he's never like too cool either for anything. Um, and now he is in, like this big movie star era, I believe. Right, he, he has gone through a transformation. It's so funny that, like you know, it used to be a rite of passage to be in something like the Notebook, right, and then you go into doing stuff like Drive or Half Nelson or Place Beyond the Pines, and then eventually, and I feel like he's the only one who's really done that road and I feel like he's the only one who's really done that road, done that route in the past 20, 30 years.
Speaker 1:I think the other one just real quick is Leo. I never really thought about it more, I never have really thought about them in comparison to each other, because Leo is a little bit older, but not much, maybe like 10 years older than Gosling, and when you think about their career trajectories they're pretty parallel to each other in the way that they've chosen their projects carefully. They've done the big budget box office draws, but it's not in an IP franchise, right, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I think maybe an interesting contrast in a way is also kind of Joseph Gordon-Levitt, who again was big on tumblr at the time, um, but he was another one who was. He was choosing these interesting projects he came up through, especially those sundance films like, uh, you know, mysterious skin, um, and all those types of 500 days of summer, obviously like films like that. Um, and never quite found a way to transition into like film acting roles. I mean, he still does a lot of TV shows and you'll see him pop up from time to time, obviously brick like he. He's a, he shows up in some Rian Johnson stuff here and there but he never quite found a way to transition the way that Gosling has, the way that maybe even someone like Tom Hardy, who I think is also pretty similar in age, like the way that Tom Hardy has, you know, I do like that comp with tom hardy, that's really good.
Speaker 1:I also think too and I mean the thing about gosling that just kind of spinning it forward, trying to think about, like, where he goes next, and maybe this is a conversation we should have for after save, for after the top fives, but, um, just kind of, you know, talk piggybacking marcus on what you were saying like what happens next after this? Like can he keep the charisma going into his 50s? That's like where carrie grant and jimmy stewart and these guys made their money, and now you don't make a movie like all about eve or something anymore. But maybe you do like, maybe he is the one that, because he's kind of like a student of the game that, that he will, based on his star power, be able to get something like that greenlit, which I think would be really exciting, because I there's interest, I feel like there's interest from him to to maintain a certain level of of integrity with with his projects.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and he's a very classical movie star. When you think about it, I mean he's a very classical movie star. When you think about it, I mean he's a song and dance man. He can do action, he can, he can do. You know, I guess we've never really seen him in a horror movie. That would be interesting to see him in like straight genre.
Speaker 3:But I was gonna say fracture. Fracture was the one I was gonna throw out thriller yeah yeah, so he has, and we'll talk about fracture more later blade runner, he, obviously has done genre, but but yeah, he he is.
Speaker 2:He is such a versatile performer yeah, um yeah, what were his three? I meant to ask this earlier, but what were his three oscar noms?
Speaker 1:I know half nelson half nelson barbie barbie and then La La Land Was also nominated for La La Land.
Speaker 3:I believe, yeah, yes, yeah he is a really he is a really capable actor. He can do a lot of different things, which I again another reason I love him.
Speaker 1:I feel like something he's really good at and I wrote a couple of other names down here, aside from the ones I've already said but the way that the way that he can, in some movies, be so charismatic and then in other movies, be turned down and brooding and mysterious, I feel like the actors that can do that the best have a really good understanding of time and space and so like, just because your line is written on the page doesn't mean that like you have to deliver it a certain way.
Speaker 1:You play around with it a little bit, you kind of chew on some scenery and I feel like, whether or not he's a kind of guy that says like I need five takes or 10 takes to figure it out, or whatever it may be, but there are just times where I'm watching him and he really understands how to take a pause, how to take a beat, and what it does then in turn is like whoever he is, whoever his counterpart is in that scene, you really feel like he is invested in in like analyzing their emotions, and so I feel like that's a really good strength of his and also, too, just kind of the way that he is, is physically acting in some of those scenes, the way he'll just like lean up against a door is like kind of really cool and that like you just see some people who don't have that and like he has it.
Speaker 1:And so I'm like is he kind of like cool and that like you just see some people who don't have that and like he has it. And so I'm like is he kind of like james dean? But is he also kind of too like clint eastwood at times, like when you think about a character like drive, that's a clint eastwood role in the in the 70s or the 80s and and he pulls that off while also having kind of like this james dean attitude, and so I don't know, know he's very classical. I like the word you use there, max.
Speaker 3:Oh, sorry, yeah, I was going to say because there's that famous anecdote about Drive where he and Carey Mulligan were like constantly like let's take the lines out of this, let's try and like bring this down so it's purely visual and that's why you get a film like drive, where it is so like withdrawn and he's so withdrawn and you have that like famous meme of like him staring at carrie mulligan and then like the real human being like all over it, yeah, um, but yeah, I, I would definitely agree with that. I think it's he's, I think he's such an interesting actor in that way.
Speaker 1:He's also interesting too, because he's one of these last superstars, these last A-list actors who and we touched on this a little bit earlier but like we feel like we know them so well but simultaneously we don't really know that much about Ryan Gosling. Like he and Eva Mendes kept their marriage just kind of out of the public eye, basically until two or three years ago, and they met on the set of Place Beyond the Pines. They have children together, they have this whole life, and because maybe he's not somebody that is working all the time I shouldn't say not working all the time, but sometimes there'll be like a two or three year gap between like a big Ryan Gosling movie and so it's somebody who you never forget about, but that you're just kind of like not concerned with what they're doing in the same way that you're concerned with what, like Tom Cruise is doing when you don't hear about him for a little while.
Speaker 1:So I think he has that. That is really something that makes his performances feel unique too and special, where, like when Ryan Gosling has a movie coming out, it's a big deal.
Speaker 3:yeah, and and that's again another reason why I'm a little surprised at the box office response yeah to the fall guy well, it is also like the, the classic movie star thing, where, like, you're limiting your exposure, and I think that's something that like someone like timmy is really good at yeah, we're like uh, it's not. You know, being in people's faces all the time, being on Instagram all the time. It's about when you show up, you make waves and then you can recede for a little while.
Speaker 3:Gosling from like 20, I think like 2011 to like 2015, was like everywhere and then disappeared for a couple of years and like that used to be pretty normal. I mean, dustin Hoffman took like five years off. Warren Beatty took like five years off and like that used to be pretty normal. I mean, dustin Hoffman took like five years off. Uh, warren Beatty took like five years off and like that used to be really common. And I think, honestly, that's the way it should be done, because, like I I don't know about you guys, but I get really annoyed seeing one actor for like five years at a time.
Speaker 1:I'm like in everything.
Speaker 2:Yeah, alone for a minute. Chris pratt uh, uh, poor chris pratt. I'm worried about timmy, though, because you know he's part of the kardashians. We need to get him out of there, but in in a way though moment.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but also too, it's funny, because let him have his fun and he's till, he shows up on bravo no, I feel like, I feel like he's kind of turning the narrative on that too, though, where he's almost making, he's making kylie jenner cooler by proxy.
Speaker 3:See, that's a bummer it.
Speaker 1:It is and it isn't, though, because I feel like he's not one that's like. You know what we know about timothy chalamet. Is it like he wants to go to kid cuddy concerts? And he wants to hang out with luca guadagnino yeah, like he, that's what he wants to do, and if he also wants to like date kylie jenner, then like okay, kylie jenner. Yeah, yeah, just said you in the same sentence with like two other really cool people.
Speaker 3:So maybe that raises your stock a little bit, yeah, but but that's again like it's exactly like you're saying. I like that.
Speaker 3:I know those things about timmy, but I and like I might see like a like a press photo of him at like coachella or something, but like I'm not gonna see Timmy like on Instagram live you know like no, and I think that's, that's a really important part of like engaging with the public as a, as a, especially as like a major movie star, um, and in terms of how you're thought of, in terms of how people are seeing you, it's really important to like limit your exposure again.
Speaker 1:All this to say that Gosling's done that basically his entire career. He's really good, and then and then that. What that really does is that it it elevates those public moments to being things of legend, Like I can still remember watching the VMAs as a kid, and they do the best kiss award, and it's him and rachel mcadams reenacting their scene from the notebook, like that was a huge thing, um, when it happened. And so I really like that you pay attention, you pay a little bit more attention to the red carpet moments.
Speaker 3:If they give, if they give an interview, you're actually paying attention to what they're saying because, again, it's not just like I've heard this person, I know they're gonna say time and time again yeah, so that, that's really exciting yeah, and I was gonna say it also makes me think of, um, the vine of, like ryan gosling won't eat his cereal and then, like the guy, that guy like passed away and then like a video came out of ryan gosling finally eating his cereal and like that.
Speaker 1:That's really nice choosing yeah. Yeah, you choose when you appear, yes, and kind of letting us know they're like I, I see yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm aware, I'm aware he listens I might not be gosling listens to this spot he listens to this spot.
Speaker 1:Well, he can't wait to hear our top five he's like max.
Speaker 3:Tell me please.
Speaker 1:I'm dying to know marcus, as as our guest, as our esteemed confidant, tonight, we'll have you go first.
Speaker 3:Okay, Number five. I'm starting at number five. Can I cheat just a pinch here? My pinch of a cheat is I'm going to start at number six with the Gangster Squad trailer which is really great.
Speaker 1:I don't know if you've seen it lately. I think Max is prepared to give a little 90 seconds on Gangster Squad as well.
Speaker 2:I took Gangster Squad for a test drive this week and man Gosling is doing a lot with that voice.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's great, and we love weird voices yeah.
Speaker 2:That movie wants to be just the hardest mafia core noir ever. It's great In the trailer. It's great In the trailer it's great In the trailer.
Speaker 3:it's great In the trailer. It's fantastic.
Speaker 2:Everyone is a cartoon in that movie.
Speaker 3:Yes, absolutely, especially Sean Penn. But my yeah, starting at number five, you guys are going to notice the theme here I, my number five is Lars and the Real Girl, another Craig Gillespie vehicle, which, if you guys recall, last time I was here I was pumping dumb money. I want to be clear that I did not set out to be a Craig Gillespie.
Speaker 3:Stan, but here I am is so he's so gentle and that's kind of a given, given what the story is about, which, if you don't know, is about a man who acquires a sex doll and then fall like, proceeds to have a like not a sexual and emotional relationship with the sex doll, and it's this kind of character study of like of him as he's, as he's doing this and like why he's doing this and all this kind of stuff. Um, and I I find gosling, especially when he's literally playing against a doll, he's doing this and like why he's doing this and all this kind of stuff. And I find Gosling, especially when he's literally playing against a doll. He's so interesting and he's so vulnerable and I think that's really one of the huge keys to him as an actor is that, like, all of his performances are so vulnerable, even where, even if, like you know that the character he's playing is doing something awful or is despicable in some way, um, you can see why they're doing it. You can see that vulnerability.
Speaker 2:So yeah, lars and the real girl color me a disciple, because lars and the real girl is my number three right now just a fantastic script. And you're so right. Right that Gosling is so vulnerable in this film, but without telling you what he's afraid of it comes across so clear.
Speaker 2:This is also a film that we've studied at school in screenwriting class. It is held very high among people who write for movies and are trying to be writers. This one of my favorite performances by Gosling, especially re-watching it this week, or at least, or watching it for the, you know all the way through for the first time. But, yeah, the themes of being afraid of loss and death come across so, so well and Gosling is amazing when he's acting against an inanimate object. It's, it's, it's. It's really something to behold and I love it. It's very subtle.
Speaker 3:There's a, there's a bit in that movie that I think about, which is, I think, like some old lady at church gives him flowers and he immediately throws them away.
Speaker 1:I thought about that, for, like the, better part of a decade Now the other thing about this movie that's really cool is that it was.
Speaker 1:It was one of the first early indicators that he was going to be someone that took chances with the roles that he, that he went after because, yes, he already had the notebook in his back pocket and you can ride the like that's, that's a good stock, you to hold on to that for as long as you possibly can. But it's like one year after half, nelson, which, yes, he's oscar nominated in that role, but again, that was a risk as well. Now you can say a white savior type of movie, even though again, it's a very vulnerable role, a very vulnerable performance. I don't want to step on anybody's toes if that's on either of your lists, but that's. Those were bold choices early in his career to to take on roles like that, and so I'm happy that it's, that it's represented on both of your lists.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know he's. He's also an intense preparer, right Like. I believe that he lived as a recluse for about six months leading up to this film, and there are stories of him trying to get Rachel McAdams fired on the set of Notebook because she wouldn't pretend to be in a relationship outside of the movie or whatever, even though they ended up, I think, dating anyway. Or him bugging James Garner on that set because he wanted to go deeper into the character of Noah and really build out a backstory and garner's just like get away from me, kid I'm just here for a paycheck.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I'm on set for three days.
Speaker 3:Yeah, sitting on this porch and get my money, yeah, yeah, there's a part of me that's always wondered I don't know about the timelines, but I've won. I've always wondered because he is um full, he's a bit more filled out in that movie and I've kind of wondered, like if that happened, almost as a as an interstitial to uh, the lovely bones where he was like originally cast, and then like he showed up on set, having like been spent six months drinking ice cream and like peter jackson was like no leave and fired him, and so I've always wondered if like that's like kind how he ended up looking.
Speaker 2:He does kind of look like the character that Stanley Tucci ends up playing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly Alright. So then Max, your number five.
Speaker 2:My number five is the Place Beyond the Pines. Is this on either of your guys' lists?
Speaker 1:Yeah, very high up, you guys can talk.
Speaker 3:I'm happy to hear it.
Speaker 1:We can talk about it now.
Speaker 2:So the first hour of this film is a Ryan Gosling film and it is nearly perfect. Like it is. What he's doing in this is everything that I want him to be doing in something like Drive or Only God Forgives. Like he is so thrilling as this bank robber who is just trying to be a father, and again vulnerability comes into play here and it's an ugly role, even though he's not necessarily unattractive in it. Yeah sure, but he's covered in tats yeah, he's got the bleach blonde hair.
Speaker 2:Oh, I remember motorcycle grease photos. Yeah, he's, he's in dirt bike shirts um, isn't he?
Speaker 3:doesn't? The movie start with him like riding a dirt bike around like a cell?
Speaker 1:again a stuntman it almost killed the dp. I remember that it's such a hard opening yeah, that, that opening goes really hard.
Speaker 2:And again, another thing that should be noted he is the master of jackets. Uh, I mean, no matter what movie it is he can please make that the title of this episode yeah, uh, place beyond the pines is excellent and and I. I think he's so good in oh man, I'll make that the title of my next short film yeah.
Speaker 2:Place Beyond the Pines is excellent and I think he's so good in it that when he exits the film unfortunately spoilers it's been out forever you feel a presence loss, you feel a Ryan Gosling hole and this almost didn't make the list because of that, because there's another I think hour and a half to go after he leaves, but that first hour I I want that movie.
Speaker 1:I just want the stunt man or the stunt bike writer movie of ryan gosling robbing banks yeah, I think that the place beyond the pines is the best movie that ryan gosling's been in, so for that reason it's my number one wow, um, this is a movie that it saw it at a very impressionable age, like I'm 22 when this movie comes out and just watched it on repeat for a couple summers in a row.
Speaker 1:You know constantly it's one of the more stacked casts that you'll ever find yeah, that you'll ever find in a movie, and and so for that reason alone, I think that the movie, although it doesn't operate on the same frequency at which it begins with, because I do think that the Gosling stuntman turned heist manned into a little bit of like a buddy movie with ben mendelsohn, into this like intense family drama with eva mendez and mahershala ali, is so so, so good.
Speaker 1:But then when you swap them out for like ray liotta and bradley cooper and rose burn and dane dehaan comes in and like sets the world on fire first time that we've really seen him in anything major. Yeah, I think it still works so well and it really does play out in three chapters, right. So it's like a heist film and then it turns into almost this like political conspiracy film that you feel like it has like cuts of a scorsese drama into it or something like that.
Speaker 2:Cop land a lot yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And then it turns into a really, really important coming of age film at the end. And that's all because Dane DeHaan is trying to connect with his father, who is Ryan Gosling, and so, even though he exits, his fingerprints are still all over the story. None of it would be happening without him, and so the power behind a performance like that is what elevates it to the top for me, because I don't think that there's, for again, a role that is not all that verbally demanding. We create such a connection. We have such a connection with him because we see him trying to do the right thing. He's a flawed person.
Speaker 1:He plays a flawed person in so many of these movies, but I do think that this is like the apex of all those roles put together, and even though he's in it for like half of the runtime, it's still so effective because of his 90 minutes or however long he spends in the film. Just an incredible movie like this. There's a movie that makes me cry when I watch it at the end, when it's that overhead shot dainty han riding off on the motorcycle filling his dad's footsteps the music like. I'm getting goosebumps right now.
Speaker 1:So, the Place Beyond the Pines, I think, is honestly one of the better movies of the 2010s and it's my favorite, ryan Gosling film.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm curious if we can just quickly sidebar here. I'm curious.
Speaker 2:I don't know if Blue.
Speaker 3:Valentine is on either of you guys' list, but I think Cianfrance uses him so well in both movies, agreed. I mean in the way that, like Max you talked about, like in Place Beyond the Pines, like the second half of the movie, really like you can feel it needing or like at least like having like a Ryan Gosling sized hole in it.
Speaker 3:I mean, that's so much the point, but that is again how I think Blue Valentine feels, where it again it's a, it's another, it's another split timeline kind of thing, examining kind of the past and the present and how they like keep informing each other. And I think that's something that Cianfrance is so good at exploring with Gosling in particular.
Speaker 1:And I think it really works in Place Beyond the Pines because that actually is what gives the Bradley Cooper character Some humility is that he feels guilty for killing this man again. Sorry for the spoilers but, it, but like it's almost intentional, I feel like taking him out of the movie when he does. I mean, of course it is. That's what the script calls for but, like everyone else understands that, like okay, now it's time to like pick up the pieces and continue this story. So I just have always loved Place Beyond the Pines.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. After watching a lot of Gosling this week, I feel like Place Beyond the Pines is the one I've thought about the most.
Speaker 1:I own a sick Region B steelbook of this Blu-ray. Oh that's tight. Yeah, Do a little show and tell after this, after this recording.
Speaker 3:And just one last quick note on place beyond the pines. I think Bradley Cooper is no slouch in that movie. He's not he's incredible in that as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he needs to play more cops, yeah.
Speaker 1:So my number five is fracture from 2007. I wasn't sure if I was going to do it and then I decided full send with Fracture. Good for you, because I feel like what I'm not on a lot of these top five lists, number five is kind of the spot to have a little bit of fun and do some recognition of like maybe how we got to where we are today. And I feel like, although the Notebook had come out right, we were like, although the notebook had had come out right, we were familiar with him via friday night lights, murdered by numbers.
Speaker 1:Some of these other films half nelson is the year after this movie and this is the same year as um, or, excuse me, the fracture comes out one year after half nelson and then larson, the real girls the same year is fracture, but those are two ryan gosling powered movies where, like, he is at the center this is the first time where he gets the opportunity to go head to head with one of the greats and he and anthony hopkins, their dynamic in this film, is really, really good and I love movies like this where you have both people thinking that they're smarter than the other person. And so he's this like hot shot district attorney that feels like this is an open and shut case. And Anthony Hopkins, who has committed this murder against his wife, is like you will not be able to find me guilty, and so that cat and mouse game between them is so good. And I do feel like there are a couple of times where, just because of Gosling's inexperience and maybe maybe this is by mistake, maybe it's by design, but like he eats his lunch in a couple of scenes, like but that's just, sir anthony, like operating on insane levels, like this is basically you could be like is this a prequel to hannibal lecter? Like he's so good and calculated in this film, but gosling is up for for sparring in every single scene and I've, and so for me, I'm like this.
Speaker 1:And when this movie came out, huge deal, um, for like the Hollywood video blockbuster home rental crowd, because not one that I saw in theaters, but once it was on home video, watched it all the time and just kept thinking like Gosling's so good, like Gosling's a great actor, like it's kind of like when you see him painted against someone like Anthony Hopkins and he does it again in his career and some other films, but like you're like he's got it. It's kind of like a passing of the torch sort of moment, and so that's why it's number five on mine, cause I wanted to recognize like that sort of turning point in his career. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Just out of curiosity, have have you seen the jinx or either of either, cause I know like that's like the story, that like it's based on right, like the jinx, and like jinx part two, that's the television show. Yeah, the it's like that. Docuseries by Andrew Jarek or something like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, I didn't know there was a connection, but yeah, might have to look it up now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're number four, marcus my number four.
Speaker 3:Yeah, my number four. Um, I is a movie that was again very formative for me growing up. Uh, it and it's a crazy stupid love, which I think is not like a like a star performance by gosling, but it is like he's. He's in 15, 20 minutes of that movie and he's just like throwing heat. I mean the there's that whole incredible sequence where he's like teaching steve carell how to dress and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 2:The Velcro, the Velcro, yeah, a great trailer moment too.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, he's just coming in and there's I mean, there's that amazing moment with Emma Stone as well. Another I think that's like their second time on screen together. Second to Gangster Squad, where you know she, I think he like takes off a shirt and she's like, oh my God, you're photoshopped. And again another an iconic trailer, a really solid movie that I have like revisited since a few times since release, and I think I think holds up. Uh, but yeah, I, I really love gauzing in that movie and I think it's a really fun movie, the kind of movie you don't really get anymore, which I hate saying it's also kind of the first time you get his real comedy chops yeah, right, yeah, I mean really where his current persona?
Speaker 3:for sure, I was gonna say, paired with the suaveness like adult, yeah, yeah yeah, and I think it would be so easy for that role to be like just extremely sleazy, absolutely that's the beauty of gosling.
Speaker 2:He, he is sleazy but he's so cool but not desperate he's just he's, he is he's suave, he's charming.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's really good.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah and listen. I hate to keep dropping this, but another movie we have studied at school. Yeah, there's also. My teacher actually brought this up. He's constantly eating in that film.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right, yeah.
Speaker 2:He's doing a very good Brad Pitt, yeah. And then towards the end of the film he talks about this hole inside of him and when he read the script he was like I'm going to be eating because I'm trying to fill this hole. So he takes people's stuff and, like really no pun intended, digests it and brings something extra. So, yeah, special, no pun intended, digests it and and brings something extra.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so yeah.
Speaker 2:Special. Yeah, uh, my number four is the notebook. Uh, this is, you know, this is when he becomes on the map right. This is the uh, opening act of the of the Ryan Gosling career. Really, this is when he becomes an official heartthrob. Before this he you know, he had been a side character on remember the titans, which he's very memorable in, but not a lot of screen time, and this, especially for people of our age, is, I mean, have you ever heard of a movie quoted more or memed more? You know, the what do you want scene is constantly on the internet.
Speaker 1:Uh, still to this day max is always trying to get me to lander traffic lights within always, always.
Speaker 3:Uh, I've done that in gig car, downtown gig harbor, a place where you can do that, yes, uh, you know if.
Speaker 2:If you're a bird, I'm a bird.
Speaker 1:If you're a podcaster, alex, I'm a podcaster, yeah I was about to put you in letterboxd jail for that review. You gotta give me more than that, I think you have to leave it's, and again, it's not the greatest movie.
Speaker 2:But like you, when you watch it, you you really side with ryan gosling, even though rachel mcadams, her character should be with the james martinson character, right, but you are just so invested in noah and I. I don't know if any other actor could make us that invested yeah, I mean it's a special performance.
Speaker 1:yeah, it's. It'd be so easy to say, like 10 years earlier, freddie Prinze Jr or somebody is in that role, but then it's just like not as important of a movie, you know where's like the notebook. And what else is funny too is look at all the other Nicholas Sparks adaptations.
Speaker 2:Not great, not great yeah, that's the one that lives on. And even as a seventh grader, when I was sitting in the second row at the Gig Harbor 3, regal 3, watching this film in the second row at the gate harbor three, regal three, watching this film, like I'm, you know, sweet home, alabama I got up and went out and played video games right in the in the hall, but I, I am glued to the screen um, just just as a note, I have to push back on your nicholas sparks note because oh, a big fault in our stars guy.
Speaker 1:No, no, no. Walk to remember, a walk to remember. I will give you a walk to remember. Thank you, yes, yeah, yeah I will not tolerate this slander on a walk to remember.
Speaker 3:An iconic soundtrack as well.
Speaker 1:I do appreciate that catch. That's a good movie. Okay, my number four is the Nice Guys from 2016.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Is this on anybody else's list? The Pines bumped this off for me Pines bumped this off, okay, this is my number one.
Speaker 3:Oh my goodness, marcus, this is my number one.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. Well, as our guest, you know when my number one comes up, when Max's number one comes up, doesn't matter, we can talk out of turn, but we'll save that.
Speaker 3:We'll save the next guest discussion, for your number one.
Speaker 1:Then hit us with your number three.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, my number three is barbie that's my number three, yeah, yeah and I, I think again it's it's kind of the platonic, the platonic ideal for gauzing at this stage of his career, at this kind of level, um, where he's he's a little bit goofy, he is still like a little bit threatening, but most threatening is maybe a weird way to put that. Uh, supply, yeah, but I think he's a little bit goofy, but I think, more than anything, he's continuing to play a character that if you don't agree with them, you can at least understand them, and I think that's the key to that whole character where he's a big, dumb idiot and there's a lot of toxic masculinity that's being explored.
Speaker 1:But it's also but he understands, he's playing an archetype, he understands that, and that's the important part of all of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, listen, this movie was a phenomenon and you know, I know it's a Margot Robbie vehicle, but Ken is kind of like the steel of the show there. I mean it is an iconic performance.
Speaker 1:It's Barbie and Ken, it's peanut butter and jelly. Yeah right.
Speaker 2:So it's yeah, it's amazing. It's funny to also. I was reading that you know Warner Brothers had to beg him to be in this movie.
Speaker 1:I do remember reading that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was a long, like six month or three month, you know courting it took Greta and Margot and basically the whole team to be like this isn't.
Speaker 1:We're not going to paint you how you might think. We're going to shape the Ken role basically. I mean this is on my list because I think, when it's all said and done, whether it's the IMDB most known for the top credit on Letterboxd, whatever's in the Wikipedia page, it's gonna be like he's gonna become synonymous with the role of Ken, and so, for the historical significance alone, I think it's worth making a top five list, but then also too, just because, like that, he's so, funny.
Speaker 1:He's so good like when max when we watched it 80 million times last summer on the road together the ken parts were the parts that, like they're comic relief by design, right, but like that make you laugh so hard each time and it's remarkable. Like I don't think any of the chris's, I don't think anybody else who, like you, might be like, oh you know, it would be really funny to see, like maybe pine or hemsworth or one of these guys in this role where gosling was the perfect choice for that role and he killed it so yeah, I was on the list.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I just think it's interesting you say that, because I imagine part of their pitch had to be that like there is a strange amount of pathos to that character and really like it would have been so easy to just have him be a very flat villain who's mad at mad at barbie, and there's a lot of like pain and that character that is really you wouldn't expect to be there. So, yeah, I I'm glad it's on your list as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yep uh, my number three was lars and the real girl, correct?
Speaker 1:yes, okay, and your three was barbie. Yes, we're back to number two now back to number two. Oh god, um, oh back to marcus for number two. My phone uh for number two.
Speaker 3:My number two is Drive and my number two is Drive. Again. I think that's where Max talked about the notebook being kind of the kickoff of Gosling's career. I think that's when Ryan Gosling arrives. For me personally, that movie came out the fall after I graduated. That that movie came out the fall after I graduated, so it was. It appeared at a time in my life when I was like, oh, I'm looking for, like a he's literally me character and he was literally me.
Speaker 3:Um and obviously it's the start of all the jackets. Uh, there's so many iconic moments in that movie. Um and again, as someone that was very much in their Tumblr phase at that period of time, that movie was all over Cinephile Tumblr. So, yeah, drive my number two Great performance from all of them. I mean Oscar Isaac's in that movie. He's fantastic. That was also like deep in my Cary Mulligan crush phase, like all sorts of stuff. So I have a lot of like nostalgia for that movie as well as like just liking it as a film.
Speaker 1:Max.
Speaker 2:No, I'll go ahead. Here's the thing.
Speaker 1:I feel like you think, that the Nicholas winning rough in catalog belongs in the mojo dojo, casa house.
Speaker 2:It is, and I'm here to tell you, zack Snyder for cinephiles.
Speaker 1:It is, is, and I'm here to tell you zach snyder for cinephiles, it is. And I'm here to tell you why do you hate fun?
Speaker 2:yes, it's not fun, it's not okay, maybe it's not fun.
Speaker 1:You know what it is. It's cool. It's so fucking cool. Why do you not like cool things?
Speaker 2:it's zach snyder for cinephiles. That's it really. Listen, I cannot deny the vibes of drive, okay, the, and even the vibes of only god forgives the vibes. The cinematography, the look, the soundtrack. We're getting an excellent performance from albert brooks oh my god, yeah.
Speaker 3:And cranston and perlman, I can't even believe. And ron perlman is having fun.
Speaker 2:Yeah, christina hendrix, I've never seen someone look better getting their head blown off.
Speaker 3:Oh, my god like scanners blown off too, yeah, but honestly re-watching it yesterday my biggest problem is gosling in this film.
Speaker 2:He, he, he is and and I know it's slow cinema and, like it, is a style and a and a and an art form and you know this is him showcasing the counter charisma, but because it's still there. But I think you he has to do. You got to give a little something, for me at least, because he does a lot of this in my number one movie and oh, sorry, go on but drive man it.
Speaker 2:I found it, I found him, I found it comedic. I mean, there were some like the moment after the, the fight in the elevator and he turns around and what he's doing with his face and whatnot. It just, it's so not. It just was not good for me, it was just I started cackling and he is very stoic and quiet and whatnot, except for one moment where he's talking to Bryan Cranston, tell him to get out, and then he's all animated. I just feel like the direction is off. And it's not my problem with Gosling, it's my problem with the director.
Speaker 2:I just find it so pretentious.
Speaker 1:Here's the interesting thing, though, about what you're saying is that it's based off a book which is not at all similar to the movie. I have to be clear about that, but but I'm just saying so it's based off a book that was then adapted and not by nicholas, and so everything that's been on the page before them that you maybe be bucking with a little bit.
Speaker 1:Yes, obviously renfin is going to come in and say this is how I picture this, this is how I see this, or whatever, but gosling's working with a character that nicholas did not create in an event. So the vibes and everything that you're responding to, you're responding to the nicholas stuff that I think works so well in this movie and then all the little character nuances that they probably came up together Like I think about. I think about a perfect scene. That's a marriage of all of this working together. So well Is it?
Speaker 1:There is like a cut scene when Oscar Isaac has returned home from prison and there's a song playing that totally speaks to what's happening between Carey Mulligan and Ryan Gosling's character. Like, all I think about is you and it's just going back and forth and it's a great little synthy song and stuff. And then he leaves his apartment because he's worked on this one piece for his car. Whatever he's going to go, put it in his car. And who's in the hallway? Carey? So he comes out.
Speaker 1:You can still hear the music playing. He does this thing again, where he just leans up against the wall and he lets the scene breathe a little bit, takes some space, takes some time. She apologizes for the music, he gives her a little cockeyed smile and says, like I was thinking about calling the cops, like it is so good, it's so good. And then oscar isaac comes out and you can feel the tension, like you can cut the tension so hard, because he says to him then oh, you know, my son, he's been, you're the guy who's been, you know, looking after my family, basically, and all that stuff. It's just like a little five minute scene and it's not one that you would think about in terms of like the I, the iconic stuff driving through the LA river basin and everything else.
Speaker 3:The opening credits with kavinsky's night call just like maybe the best needle drop of that decade, god absolutely and but and so it's a little scenes like that where I'm like, no, this, this movie's got it it does well even in that, in that scene you're describing like because so much of it does also come down to him leaning a certain way, him looking a certain way. In that scene in particular, like I remember, oscar Isaac says you're the one that's been looking out for my son, and like he literally has his son like yes, not like pinned, but like against him, and he's like his arm is like over his son and he's making his kid take out the trash.
Speaker 1:Yes, which is such a just. You are a scuzzy piece of shit.
Speaker 3:Oscar Isaac. It's such a good, subtle little thing yeah.
Speaker 1:And I just think, like again, like he said, let mommy talk to her friend. Yeah.
Speaker 3:Like like so much of what he's saying and I agree with all that is. I think a lot of that movie really does just come down to the vibes. A lot of that movie really does just come down to the vibes, but also, like the blocking and kind of the. It's a film that is very, very carefully paced and I have to say, Max, I'm really bummed out that you are not a real hero or a real human being.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I can't give you a night call. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't know, man, I just feel so shallow when I watch that film and, like I, I again, again it's his. I think it's his first feature film.
Speaker 3:it's and it's something to behold as a first feature and it's it's his first american film. Yeah, he made like five, like five or six, like danish films but I'm telling you, when I'm watching that film, I am.
Speaker 2:I'm feeling the same way about when I'm watching zack snyder stuff and and that's not just the slow motion stuff, but it's just this and I know the letterboxd lords are going to come for me, but it is just this masculine, like slow cinema. Look how cool this fucking shot is. Garbage, I'm sorry. I think we need that, I mean, and I think we need more of that.
Speaker 3:And that's again why I think in 2011,.
Speaker 1:That's why this film got adopted as like an instant saving grace for this marriage between art house cinema and like movie star action driven stuff, because you had both of it in such like 2011. Not only let's just talk about the the entire cinematic landscape when marvel is like cranking them out and everything is ip driven, but also in 2011 he does crazy stupid love drive and the ides of march yeah, which, like ides of march, is excellent.
Speaker 2:That's an mvp season. Yeah, right there. Oh yeah he does those three?
Speaker 1:yeah and so not only do you have that little like um triplet pairing there, but when when I look at the three nicholas, wending, ref and films that I like the most, there's Only God Forgives and another Gosling film and I think that that's honestly like the Goldilocks bowl of porridge. That's too cold, like to me that one is effective, but there's almost there's, I think there's in that film you have too much of the kind of thing that you're describing. But there needs to be a recognition that when you go into Only god forgives you're going to be watching a painting. Basically it's just neon, it's nothing but neon and karaoke and there's like some weird lynch vibes happening and but I but I like it for that, like I'll still eat that bowl of porridge. And then the neon demon, which I think is my favorite.
Speaker 1:It is my favorite of his films and I think maybe one of like it's on, it'd be on my short list of favorite films for the all decades team probably doesn't make it, but like the Neon Demon I think is just so scintillating. That's the piping hot bowl of porridge and Drive's right in the middle, drive is the Goldilocks bowl of porridge. That is just right when it comes to actually because, like I actually don't think it's as slow as you think it is. It's a faster paced film and the slow motion comes in at very purposeful moments. I just I don't know. I want you to be over here with us so bad.
Speaker 1:Listen, I watched it yesterday and when writing about it, I remember trying to get you to watch this after the Academy Awards, like three years ago or something you were like. I'm about to go home and I'm, like you, sure you don't want to fire up. Drive 30 minutes of it and you're like I gotta go.
Speaker 2:It's just not going to happen. It just doesn't speak to me. I'm sorry.
Speaker 3:I am curious and I don't want to step on your toes. If this is what your number one is.
Speaker 3:I think I know what he does, that like five, I guess five or six year period where he's doing things like drive, where he does drive, he does Place and I I think we saw it together or we have this like ongoing argument, because I just I get absolutely nothing from First man to the point where, like the movie, if you haven't seen it it ends with, like Ryan Gosling like in a like a hazard, not hazardous, but like he's just come back from the moon, basically, and he can't like speak to his wife and he can only speak to her through glass.
Speaker 3:and I could only think about like the ending of um, of uh, or that moment in anchorman when he's like, oh, I'm in a glass box of emotion and like I was just like he's literally like in a glass case of emotion, not even emoting like yeah, and so like it's interesting because he does have that five year period, or I guess, six year period If you want to include a 2049 in there, but he has a whole run of films that are like that and I think your mileage may vary, no matter what.
Speaker 2:Really, yeah, first, first man is not like splitting hairs.
Speaker 3:Cause right, yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the whole stoic gosling yes, right, and I guess I just comes down to.
Speaker 2:I just need, I just need a little bit of the movie, just a little bit more from from him in in stuff like place beyond the pines, because I think he's doing a lot of the similar things and drives, yeah, yeah but there's just something a little bit more there, a little bit for me, a little bit deeper, a little bit more that I can grab on to and enjoy more.
Speaker 1:You know, a couple episodes ago, when there was a mailbag question on like what, if like what's, what do you and max disagree on, or?
Speaker 2:something like that or whatever I can't believe.
Speaker 3:Well, it's just nicholas winding rough yeah, yeah, that's like yeah, I can't believe we didn't think of it in the moment there because because that's it that's it yeah, yeah, uh, oh gosh my number one was placed beyond the pines, my number two.
Speaker 2:My number two is is la la land oh okay, oh yeah, we're still on two gosh and we're chatting, we're chatting. We're having a good time, yeah yeah, number two, la la land, to me is kind of it's the third in the in the emma stone ryan gosling trilogy. It is kind of the ascension for both of them as a-list stars.
Speaker 2:It is again him being a classical actor, like it is the song and dance that's really what it is the ascension for, yeah, yeah it is kind of this next level that he kind of taps into, which he doesn't show us up until that moment really, apart from, you know, really early Mickey Mouse stuff Because he I feel, like in La La Land he finally comes out of the indie world or the smaller pictures and becomes a mainstream star and I just I love it.
Speaker 2:I love the way I was watching it this week and I love the way he talks about jazz and again, that's probably more with the filmmaker and more of Chazelle's voice coming through. But the way he talks about jazz is how we talk about movies and so I just connect to this character of Sebastian so much. And just again, again he does a little bit of the sad boy stare stuff, like at the very end, the last scene where he is able to act with just looking down the barrel. I love La La Land, I think it really is a a momentous film and especially for something to come out in 2016, like or whenever it did in the 2010s, you know, a musical of that stature and and I I don't want to say class, but like just polish maybe- yeah, so love La La Land.
Speaker 3:There's a huge part of me that does wonder if because obviously he and Emma Stone have done three, four movies together and Emma Stone's like deep in working with Yorgos I would love to see them work together on a Yorgos movie. Personally, I just like I feel like he'd be such a good fit in that kind of milieu and it'd be so fun to see. That's on my wish list.
Speaker 2:I hope Gosling, you know Barbie the fall guy. I feel like this is kind of like the big movie star era. I want him to go back to like go work with Yorgos, go work with do another Nicholas Rem, winding Rem thing you know? Show me, tell me, show me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can just rewatch drive and try it again. Take it for another test drive. I.
Speaker 2:I, I will return. I, yeah, I listen. You have to. You have to keep watching stuff, even if you don't like it.
Speaker 1:So drive is my number two. So yeah, circle back around.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, even if you don't like it. So Drive is my number two. So, yeah, circle back around. Yeah, yeah, my number one is the Nice Guys, which I think is, at least as far as we've seen in his career so far. I think it's the platonic ideal for Ryan Gosling at this level. I think it does. He's still playing a character that is maybe not the most pleasant to be around and he's still playing that kind of vulnerability, but there's a lot of comedy in the role. So much.
Speaker 3:Shane Black knows how to use him so perfectly, because Gosling, in addition to being a very vulnerable actor just looking at him you get a lot but he's such a gifted physical actor, which is why he's so good in La La Land when he's doing the dancing and it's why he's so good, I think, in Barbie as well, and I just think he's fantastic in it. I love the dynamic with him and Russell Crowe. That's really fun. Yeah, I just I love that whole movie. There's so many bits I think about in that movie.
Speaker 1:Um, yeah, I could go on about this for a long time it's my number four because I think that you said it a lot more eloquently than I'll be able to say. But it is just like that shane black recognition of what you were talking about earlier his, um, his, the way that gosling looks up to somebody like gene wilder. You take gene wilder and you take shane black and the things I put down is like you basically then get like a three stooges meets lethal weapon yeah, type of performance, yeah out of gosling in this movie where the sounds it's not even sometimes his acting, but like his screaming and the way he responds to things.
Speaker 1:It's so slapstick yeah, and it, but it's also such. The film is such a love letter to like 1970s Hollywood and different. I think. Like there's some Magnum PI influences and there's just so many private investigator. Like there's some Chinatown and there's so so many private investigator, um, like there's some chinatown and there's so many different things in there that they're pulling from. And I think what this movie really helped to do and it also is has a lot to do with that crow gosling dynamic is I think that somebody like tarantino probably watched this movie and said, okay, it is, it is time for me to make my love letter to 1970s, like kind of buddy movies and and do once something like once upon a time in hollywood.
Speaker 2:That's a great yeah.
Speaker 1:That's a yeah because the point the, the banter in the back and forth between gosling and crow in this movie you could almost put up against against pitt and dicaprio and once upon a time Time in Hollywood and it's in pretty similar situations.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:The bit I think about.
Speaker 3:And you got.
Speaker 1:Margaret Qualley connecting the two.
Speaker 3:As always, there you go, there's your sixth degree. Yeah, as it should be.
Speaker 2:The bit I think about in this film is when he punches the glass.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And then he looks at it and goes that's a law of blood.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it's again like it's not, like he's not big, he's not loud, but like his timing is just perfect, yeah, and I think something that that movie really does, uh, really well, and it's something that gosling does so well throughout his career um is the thing that all like actors of his stature and certainly of like with his looks, know how to do, which is undercut those good looks with like someone like Paul Newman would play very sleazy. Someone like Gosling plays very dopey and very unrefined, and I think he's so good at doing something like that, and so that's part of why I think he's so good at taking aspects of Gene Gene Wilder's performances and kind of bring them into his own work and what he likes to do.
Speaker 1:And it really helps in all those other roles too that we've already talked about yeah right where, like it's, it's easy to make him an ugly person on the inside and rough around the edges physically when, like your canvas, is still ryan gosling yeah, to work with because you put you put engine grease on him. You put a dirty, torn up white tee and peroxide bleached hair and place me on the pines and I'm like I'd fuck that guy Exactly. I'm like look at this man, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:And I think it just within the Shane Black of it all too. I mean, it's it? Just the thing I always get from watching a Shane Black movie is how much fun the actors are having.
Speaker 3:And he seems like he's just having a blast playing with that language, playing with, like, all of the elements that Shane Black is giving him. So it just seems like I think some of the best movies ever made you know, apocalypse Now notwithstanding are films that seem like they were fun to make, and that's also what draws in an audience, is why so many people went to Barbie, et cetera et cetera.
Speaker 1:All right, so then we're just down to max's number one.
Speaker 2:My number one is blade runner 2049, uh they made a sequel this. So again, much like uh, place beyond the pines.
Speaker 1:This is where you get gosling, towing the line between subtle jokes, charisma and the sad boy stare and you are a little bit of the uh lars and the real girl action with anna de armas too, yeah and, uh, you are along for the ride.
Speaker 2:he, he draws you in and it's a very confusing movie.
Speaker 2:Like every time I rewatch this, I'm, I'm confused, I'm, I'm confused, until about the 40 minute mark, even though I know what's going to happen.
Speaker 2:But he does such a good job of and Villeneuve does a really good job of immersing you and drawing you in and you just you start to feel emotions for this robot that is Ryan Gosling, and because you are in step with him trying to figure out the mystery of whether or not he's born or made.
Speaker 2:This film had an impossible task going into it, trying to make a sequel to blade runner, which is one of the most beloved movies of all time. But like I think it it it does such a good job of that lineage and he does such a good job of kind of carrying the torch for harrison ford even though harrison does show up in this movie, but also like he probably, being on set with Harrison, probably pushed Harrison to give what might be his best performance, um, of of Harrison's career. Because, listen, post, you know the fugitive or air force one, maybe you know Harrison Ford's just doing a lot of grumbling most of the time, uh, and I feel like, I feel like the factor of Gosling in this film is is is just really important. I don't think, I don't think anyone else could have done that role the way gosling does I.
Speaker 1:I love this movie. I think this is a five-star movie. I think that it's a director's movie. I think that it's a production movie.
Speaker 2:I think honestly, my lore movie, yeah, my top two are kind of like these are really amazing films with ryan g in them. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Which is fair. I mean, that's why. I have placed me on the pines of my number one, even though I still think in through our conversation, it's been made clear that that's still his movie that he carries, whereas 2049 didn't make my list just because so many other people are responsible for that film success. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:I do like 2049. I haven't seen it since released.
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, I I do like 2049. I haven't seen it since release. I am probably due for a rewatch. Talk about vibes. That movie is yeah, that's. That's. That's on emmer score. You don't like nicholas whining, right? Um, yeah, no, all that movie is is synth score and neon lights.
Speaker 3:Guess what nicholas is good at I I do think, especially on the topic of like directors. I think like that's an interesting movie, framing it through Villeneuve I can never say his name Through his filmography, because like that's the movie where he like makes that leap because he's gone from I mean, he does Prisoners, then he does.
Speaker 1:Sicario, yeah, prisoners Sicario Enemy, those kinds of things.
Speaker 3:And leaping to that budget level, like what? $250 million, something insane. I mean that's a sink or swim and like to make a film that's going camera operator to director.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:To like make that leap is enormous. It regardless of the film's financial success. Uh it it. The film has lived on um in such a way, or at least in in my experience talking with people um that film bros, yeah uh that I box lords yeah, uh, shout out my friend kyle, who won't understand any of this.
Speaker 3:He always gives me shit for that, uh. But I, I think with 2049, like it's a film that like that's a hard leap to make, and to even make it in in a critically successful way is a success, um, and that's an interesting way to look at that movie through vilno's filmography. But for gosling you're, you're dead on, like it's a great performance. It's a great performance from um, from harrison ford, uh, very, very much a vibes movie as well it is, yeah, I someone you mentioned earlier, because I re-watch this movie all the time.
Speaker 1:I've talked about this movie recently.
Speaker 3:It's kind of being like my movie nyquil for a while there, like yeah, kind of just put it on and like like you, respect the movie yeah enough to where you're like all and deacons too, and you're like I will respectfully fall asleep to this movie.
Speaker 1:Yeah you know um and and so, yeah, you put that on when you can't sleep at night. You just get like 45 minutes of that score and the, the cars floating around and everything. That's really really good stuff. Um, the. The interesting thing is the tom hardy thing.
Speaker 1:Back at the beginning, I think someone like tom could have played this role now I don't think any of the chris's I don't think anybody else kind of around this um kind of generation could pull it off, except tom hardy I feel like would have been an interesting one in this role.
Speaker 3:I I think so. I tom is such a weird guy. He's got like a weird brando charisma to him yes, but I could have brought something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, he would have brought a weird voice. Yeah, yeah, but again it's well, it doesn't talk a lot. Yeah, you don't talk a lot, true, that's true that's why I almost feel like it could work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you can maybe plug him into drive, who knows?
Speaker 3:oh, you could definitely plug him into drive yeah, yeah, yeah tom's, tom's. Yeah, we could do. We could do this all day. I thought about like tom hardy for ryan gosling, but I think you could like swap them in certain roles, especially during that like five or six year run.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, um any honorable mentions that we want to get out there I mean eyes of march.
Speaker 2:Uh is just a banger like just a movie, really I know we say this all the time, but truly a movie that is not made anymore. That's the one.
Speaker 1:That's the, that's the doctorate degree of fracture, fracture, fracture is him trying it out against anthony hopkins and then clooney about five, six years later. However long it was was like all right, you want to come to play in the big leagues, yeah I'm directing you in this film you're going against me, giamatti and philip seymour hoffman and marissa tomei and marissa tomei and jeffrey wright, and I mean evan rachel wood is really good in that film max manjela.
Speaker 2:He's pretty solid too. That movie's like 10 deep. Um. I love that movie, so that's a really that's on hbo max right now.
Speaker 1:I'm pretty sure it is stream.
Speaker 3:That's a fun one, yeah, um, I, I'm gonna shout out the gray man.
Speaker 1:No, I'm not sorry, I will shout out the united states of leland. You ever seen that movie?
Speaker 3:uh, I haven't, but I've heard. It's amazing that I've heard.
Speaker 1:It's really great that's a really good one from that internet boyfriend yeah, um era, but almost it almost predates that though, because that's like 2003, like I always think of that movie in the same way that I think about jill and hall and donnie darko oh yeah, where you're playing, yeah you're playing a, a troubled, like teenager he is playing like a teenager in that film.
Speaker 1:Um, and you're being really vulnerable and it's an indie film and it picked up steam. I remember I rented this at the fox island grocery store. Oh, watched it with my buddy dylan and that's just like this story really weird way to spend a night when you're 16 years old or how old we were watching that movie, but it's like oh dude, this ryan gosling guy. Like yeah, yeah um, so that's it.
Speaker 2:That's a good one that I recommend checking out. I'd also like to shout out uh, papyrus, and papyrus too, the snl sketches about ryan gosling uh obsessing over the font of the avatar movies yeah, yeah and how they are just so papyrus. He's also really good in the kate mckinnon alien abduction oh my god, one of the best, one of the best snl like hosts we've had.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah, over the past decade, yeah, I've still yet to watch the beavis and butthead skit.
Speaker 2:Just because everything I've been told and that I've read is that like it's a momentous event and and that like, and so I kind of want to treat it like I'm gonna watch a movie at home yeah, he showed up to fall guy the premiere, as is he butthead or I'm not sure which one he is.
Speaker 1:I haven't watched it yet, because I need to pop my popcorn I need to sit down, I need to have like a clean room I and then watch that sketch because from everything that I've heard is that it's just hilarious, it's phenomenal.
Speaker 3:Uh, my uh honorable mentions two bit parts where he again shows up kind of throwing heat Big Short. I am the world's foremost defender of Adam McKay, especially his dramatic work. I will go down, I will die on that ship and Remember the Titans, which, as a big uh sports film lover, um, he is really good and uh, that was actually, I think, maybe the first place I noticed him, but yeah, I think that was the first time I ever saw him.
Speaker 1:He's great adam mckay producing a new film called flesh of the gods. You heard about this. Is he producing that?
Speaker 3:christian stewart and oscar isaac oh my god, I knew, knew he was making that movie with Robert Pattinson, where Robert Pattinson's a serial killer that gets famous and so they won't take him to jail. Oh, I haven't heard of that one. Yeah, I can't remember what it's called, but that's amazing that he's producing that. That's Oscar Isaac and Kristen Stewart.
Speaker 1:Yes, sounds great. So McKay may be reinventing himself a little bit here as a financier.
Speaker 3:he doesn't, he doesn't need to invent reinvent himself.
Speaker 1:He should keep making the films he makes.
Speaker 3:Don't look up. Uh, you know that I will say that is the one I haven't seen.
Speaker 1:I did, but I love vice I love vice.
Speaker 2:I like vice a lot, big shorts, excellent, big short.
Speaker 3:I really like and weirdly I like, I do like his comedies, but I think, like other guys, is where I really start to walk in with him so that's fair, that's yeah I mean stepbrothers, is great you want to come back for the mckay pod? Look, if you are doing a mckay mckay pod, I want to be on it, I will.
Speaker 1:I will finally watch don't look up, all right? Well, that wraps up our discussion on the fall guy and Ryan Gosling. Marcus, thank you so much for joining us on this adventure. We hope you had fun.
Speaker 3:Yeah, thanks so much for having me. This was really great.
Speaker 1:Absolutely Okay. So, as we spin things forward and look ahead to next week's episode, we'll be chatting about the new film Kingdom of the Planet of the Apes, max, you've already started your homework, clearly for that project? What do you forecast for that show? How much meat is on that bone?
Speaker 2:Oh man, I hope it's a hearty orangutan amount of meat, but man.
Speaker 3:I hope it's an orangutan.
Speaker 2:I don't know. You know who it's directed by Nope, your beloved Maze Runner director. Whatever his name is. You guys want a sidebar on Maze Runner we can talk Maze Runner All day, all day.
Speaker 3:I love the Maze Runner movies. Let's talk. Okay, we're bringing you back for the young adult.
Speaker 1:I've still yet to get my young adult episode YA fiction adaptations.
Speaker 3:Look, we can make plans.
Speaker 1:I'll be here for mckay I'll talk to adult films like we can talk, uh, jason reitman's young adult while we're at it, it'll be great uh, marcus, do you have one of the uh favorite planet of the apes movie?
Speaker 3:um, weirdly I haven't seen all of them. I I saw like the most recent trilogy and I loved them. So I mean, of those ones, I like the middle one. The middle one really stuck with me, like it really shook me to my core when I saw it uh, but I haven't seen all of them and I feel like I I'd really like them now. Um, I have a lot of friends who've like gone back and revisited them and I just feel like they're right up my alley.
Speaker 1:So I don't want to like put the cart before the horse, but I think it's one of the best science fiction trilogies of the 21st century.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they get better every time. This is what the 10th Planet of the Apes movie.
Speaker 1:I believe and see. That's what I'm going to have to do. I'm going to have to go back and watch the Charlton Heston stuff Beneath the Planet of the Apes.
Speaker 2:The second one listen, it rips.
Speaker 3:I'll tell you right now and it gets weird, but I love it, but that but that's what's so good about that series that I think, like they, they do get weird and they aren't afraid to like confront real issues. I mean, if I was and explore some like some fear, some fear, yeah, some some real, real stuff, so yeah, I mean I I really should go back and watch those, because I haven't. I haven't seen any of the older ones outside. I did see like the original one, but I was like 16. What did?
Speaker 1:I know, this NRA guy what?
Speaker 3:This guy All right.
Speaker 1:So in the meantime, follow. Excuse the Intermission on Instagram and the three of us on Letterboxd. Where else can people find you, Marcus?
Speaker 3:I can be found on Instagram and Facebook under Marcus Baker Film. I can be found on Letterboxd, but I would prefer not to disclose. So if you find me, then congratulations, you found me.
Speaker 1:I don't want to lead anybody to you then, but we all follow Marcus. It's a great follow.
Speaker 3:If you would like to follow me, you're welcome to. I wrote plenty of reviews in the early in the early part of 2020 they're very long. Uh oh, and while I guess, while we're talking about it, I wrote a long defense of power of the dog which max so nice, so pleasantly called the power of the nap I'm not the only one in the world that is a staple of eti.
Speaker 1:Uh, jargon did you hear my take on the best pitcher winners from the 2020s so far. I don't think so that I think that they're pretty weak. I think they're okay that's fair. Yeah, it's because power of the dog didn't win. Well that's that's that is like a world that I would not want to live in, where, like that argument would be, I feel like even stronger if Power the Dog had beaten Coda that year.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, and so that's I don't know yeah. Yeah, and I will say if you follow me on any social media, you will find out that I am.
Speaker 1:Jane Campion fan page.
Speaker 2:I am the.
Speaker 3:Jane Campion fan page. That is all you will find on my page Jalipsy McKay, campion Young adult.
Speaker 1:Young adult. It's the whole truth. Fiction adaptations, young adult fiction adaptations.
Speaker 3:Yeah, look, if you want to hear a defense of her first film, two Friends, come find me All right, and on that note, we'll see you next time on ETI, where movies still matter.
